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standard weights and measures

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standard weights and measures

Postby mark111757 » Mon Apr 09, 2018 11:44 pm

What on earth is a standard worldwide cup?? Never heard of that before....

Gill edit:
Referring to this recipe: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=3656#p57555
I've split the topic, as weights and measures approaches are an interesting one.

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Re: Call it Scallopine or Piccata (Annoyed Chicken)

Postby mark111757 » Mon Apr 09, 2018 11:49 pm

Here in the states, 1/4 stick of butter is 4 tbsp. Where the whole stick is 4 ounces or 113.5 grams. Oh the things we learn

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Re: Call it Scallopine or Piccata (Annoyed Chicken)

Postby Renée » Mon Apr 09, 2018 11:53 pm

Yes, but Mark! How on earth do you measure 4 Tbsp butter? Would that be level, rounded or heaped?

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Re: Call it Scallopine or Piccata (Annoyed Chicken)

Postby mark111757 » Tue Apr 10, 2018 12:46 am

Renée


The wrappers on american butter are , for the most part, are labeled in tbsp increments. 2tbsp would make a mighty nice knob of butter.

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Re: Call it Scallopine or Piccata (Annoyed Chicken)

Postby Alexandria » Tue Apr 10, 2018 1:03 am

Mark,


French Verutile Manufacturer or Pyrex Manufacturer, " 2 cup glass measuring cups" are world wide measuring cups for countries using the Metric system of measurement ..
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Re: Call it Scallopine or Piccata (Annoyed Chicken)

Postby Alexandria » Tue Apr 10, 2018 1:05 am

Renée, :thumbsup :thumbsup

I would use 3 tablespoons of butter and do not level it off but do not overload the tablespoon ..

Have a lovely evening .. :wave :wave
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Re: Call it Scallopine or Piccata (Annoyed Chicken)

Postby MariaK » Tue Apr 10, 2018 4:50 pm

mark111757 wrote:What on earth is a standard worldwide cup?? Never heard of that before....



Alexandria wrote:French Verutile Manufacturer or Pyrex Manufacturer, " 2 cup glass measuring cups" are world wide measuring cups for countries using the Metric system of measurement ..


Really?

I've never come across "2 cup glass measuring cups". I do have a Pyrex type jug which has 2 measures 1/4 (250 ml)and 1/2 litre , and fractions, as well as USA cups, 240ml. The UK has been metric since c 1970 and yet most of the cups available are the US 8.11 fl oz or 240mls size. Australian cups are 250 ml. and to add to the confusion 1 Canadian cup : 227.30 ml.or /.7.9 fl oz i.e. they use UK and not USA fl. oz - although in theory they too went metric in the 1970s

France, Spain, Italy and most Central European countries (metric) don't use cups and never have – they used to and continue to use glasses (250 ml) . as was also traditional in most, if not all, of Ibero- America. Though I have noticed in recent years, especially in northern S.America, as well as Central and N. America (Mexico) that cups (tazas) have crept in – the result of the Monroe doctrine ??!!! (Grin) Obviously not literally – but it is undoubtedly under USA influence in many ways. As scales became cheaper then weight was preferred to volume, especially for baking.

So there’s no such thing as a “world wide measuring cup” if only because the vast majority never did use cups and still don’t. Cups were used in the UK - before the advent of cheap scales . and the recipes exported to the USA , Canada, Australia ….

Since your recipe is clearly copied from a US magazine /book /website, and you wish those making it to follow it to the letter, a 250ml cup would not be accurate.

Incidentally, as Mark mentioned ¼ stick of butter (1 oz) is 2 tablespoons or 28.4 g. for those who prefer to weigh

Thank goodness for online conversion tables.

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Re: Call it Scallopine or Piccata (Annoyed Chicken)

Postby Alexandria » Tue Apr 10, 2018 10:12 pm

Maria,


This is a recipe originally prepared with Veal from Italy as my great great and great paternal grandmother were from Italy ( prior to immigrating to Gerona .. )

Well, my French Glass Measuring Cup Manufactured by Verutile, is a 2 Cup and in metric only ..

Barcelona as well as Madrid have amazing cookware shops and then of course, there is El Corte Ingles Department Stores throughout the country ..

So, before you make comments, on posts, I would check your facts 1st .. :thumbsdown :thumbsdown

Have a nice evening ..
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Re: Call it Scallopine or Piccata (Annoyed Chicken)

Postby Pampy » Wed Apr 11, 2018 12:31 am

So your "2 cup glass" holds 500ml, whereas a US "2 cup glass" (if indeed one exists) would hold 480ml and a Canadian "2 cup glass" would hold 454.6ml - so there can't be a universal measure.

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Re: Call it Scallopine or Piccata (Annoyed Chicken)

Postby karadekoolaid » Wed Apr 11, 2018 2:11 am

I have to confess that I do NOT use cups - unless they´re filled with tea or coffee.
Measure a cup of long grain rice. Then a cup of Basmati. Then a cup of Arborio. Then a cup of wild rice.
ALL different weights.
I can´t get my head around it!

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Re: standard weights and measures

Postby Gillthepainter » Wed Apr 11, 2018 10:30 am

My old scratched pyrex jug is useless for measuring.
No visible markings left.

I have a set of plastic cups/ half cups etc Joseph Joseph for my American vegan books.
But otherwise, prefer scales @ grams.

I've got Dualit weighing scales that I really like.
But as with most things, they take up space on the counter. It's easier to whip out and put away the slim digital ones.

In my house, no standard Euro measurement I'm afraid.
I'm still all over the place.



I do weigh my pasta. 120g per person. No matter what shape.

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Re: standard weights and measures

Postby Stokey Sue » Wed Apr 11, 2018 11:26 am

As a scientist, experienced in accurate measurement and conversion, I can confirm that there is no such thing as a worldwide measuring cup

The size of the cup naturally depends on the underlying unit of measurement in the location

In the UK we do not have a standard measuring cup as such, but in UK Imperial measure the unit of liquid measurement is the fluid ounce, and 20 fluid ounces make one Imperial pint. Older recipes may reference a teacup (6 fluid ounces) or a breakfast cup (8 fluid ounces). Our Pyerex jugs do come marked up with 8oz cups though few people use them I suspect.

Americans also use fluid ounces, but the American pint is only 16 ounces, and the American cup is therefore 8 fluid ounces = 240 ml approximately. I've never understood why butter would be measured in tablespoons but I know it is half an ounce so no problem.

Conveniently, the smaller US pint means that 1 US quart = 1 litre pretty closely.

Australians and most of Europe use metric, millilitres, litres, and grams. Australians do use cup measures, but theirs are metric cups so 250 ml, a little bigger thanAmerican ones

If you buy a set of cup measures in the UK they will usually be metric European ones, mine are German. I don't really use them for cooking much, but they are great for portioning (a 1/4 cup is a small portion of rice, and 1/3 a large one, for example) and for quick liquid measure.

The trouble is, all over the world, people use traditional, local volume measures - the French use verres (glasses) and bols (coffee bowls) for example, in the Middle East and Burma they use tins which though different are roughly an 8 oz cup or slightly smaller. Recently Sakkarin had a recipe that called for "an after dinner coffee cup", which we decided was a demi-tasse, holding 75 ml

The good news is that obviously if you stick to the same size of cup within a recipe it often doesn't matter too much as the proportions are what count, though you can go wrong with items like eggs and lemons

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Re: standard weights and measures

Postby Gillthepainter » Wed Apr 11, 2018 11:38 am

Yes, I made a coffee cup recipe from Turkey. Twas a savoury cake.
My habitat coffee bowls took exactly 300g.

I used it as a standard throughout the recipe.
I'd not seen a coffee cup unit before. I've certainly never seen an after dinner coffee cup.

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Re: standard weights and measures

Postby Stokey Sue » Wed Apr 11, 2018 12:16 pm

That's the other "cup" - I have seen internet recipes measured in mugs - a common or garden British coffee mug is 10 fluid oz / 300 ml

The one that annoys me is temperature, often given without a unit which is simply wrong.
400 F = 200 C = gas mark 6 (no fan)
356 F = 180 C = gas mark 6 (fan)
That assumes your oven is accurate of course, I've just acquired an oven thermometer and my top oven is cool and my main (fan) oven is scorching, which explains a lot

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Re: standard weights and measures

Postby Gillthepainter » Wed Apr 11, 2018 12:56 pm

Ha.
The temperature thing is important if you like your baking, Sue.

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Re: standard weights and measures

Postby Joanbunting » Wed Apr 11, 2018 2:35 pm

When I wrote recipes in the olden days I had to juggle imperial, metric and American as well as oven temperature for gas electricity and Aga.

These days I try to use the appropriate quantities and temperatures for the origin of the recipe. I have both old fashioen alance scales and an electronic one which helpfully allows to me work in lbs, kgs, litres and fluid oz. I also have a very useful measuring litre jug which is also calibrated in cups and fl oz. DD bought it for me from Pampered Chef along with a set of measuring spoons.

French recipes can be confusing sometimes when they require grams of cream or fromage blanc.
It is amazing how Gran, who was a brilliant baker, never owned a set of scales and cooked in a range cooker without any indication of temperature and didn't have a rolling pin either - she used an old glass bottle with a stopper which she filled with cold water

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Re: standard weights and measures

Postby Gillthepainter » Wed Apr 11, 2018 3:51 pm

I didn't use to have scales either, our Joan.

I'd work on 5g = 1 teaspoon.

And would even count out 100 teasps to get 500g of flour.

As soon as I got my Dualit scales, I once checked out my clunky teasp method, and it was surprisingly close.
I hesitate to say accurate.

What a thoughtful gift from your DD.

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Re: Call it Scallopine or Piccata (Annoyed Chicken)

Postby Stokey Sue » Wed Apr 11, 2018 4:06 pm

Alexandria wrote:This is a recipe originally prepared with Veal from Italy as my great great and great paternal grandmother were from Italy ( prior to immigrating to Gerona .. ) .


I have asked you this befroe - as they are family recipes, why do you write them in US measures? Would it not be clearer for all of us and easier for you if you just wrote them in the original measures, and we could work them out or ask if not clear? On this board there are a few Americans (mark, Minnesota Maven etc.) but most of us are in the UK

As well as cups you mentions the US measurement of "1/2 stick of butter" - in the US a stick is a standard 4 oz, which looks much like an EU 250g block cut in half along the length, and does have the advantage of making it very easy to judge sections by eye, but I know from years on these forums people in the UK don't alwaysunderstand the term.

You say in fact "1 / 2 stick of French butter 82% butter fat or 1/4 stick of French butter and 4 tablespoons of Italian Extra virgin olive oil " so if 4 tablespoons oil will replace 1/4 stick of butter, clearly the stick is US style 4oz (125 grams approx), not the usual French 250 g block

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Re: standard weights and measures

Postby mark111757 » Wed Apr 11, 2018 6:40 pm

Sue

I think I may have messed up.

In a pound of American butter, 454g, unless it is a whole block, there are 4 x 4 ounce/4 quarter pound/4 x 113.5g sticks. There are 8 tbsp in each of those sticks.

Apologizes for the confusion.

I have seen the kerrygold butter in a 227g/8 ounce pack or president butter also in a 198g/7 ounce pack.

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Re: standard weights and measures

Postby Stokey Sue » Wed Apr 11, 2018 7:53 pm

No, I think we agree
4 sticks in 1 pound, so 4 oz each, 8 tbsp in a stick, so the easy conversion for someone like me who is more used to weight is that 1 tbsp = 1/2 oz

We used to be able to buy baking margarine packed like that in the UK (perhaps 1968 or thereabouts), but evidently only my Mum bought it, as it wasn't around for long, and nobody else remembers it :lol:

Butter in the UK used to be packed in 8oz / 227 g blocks here but I have two different brands of British unsalted butter around, both 250 g

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